I was raised as a JW, and even though I am no longer an active member, they are the best branch of Christianity. I'll give some brief reasons why.

-No pagan holidays
-No belief in Hell
-Worships God, not Christ
-Does not make a materialistic symbol the object of prayer
-Much fewer contradictions


There are many more, and if any of you disagree, I dare you to come forth. The Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses is the only true Christian institution left. They are as upstanding as Mormons, but with no racism, fundamentalism, or blatant lies to bring them down. Other branches of Christianity are a joke.

They are the best because you like them the best? Cool, dude.

Sounds like a jackass of a God to me

I have a JW book called You Can Live Forever in Paradise on Earth. It's freaking crazy.

Their ridiculous feelings on blood transfusions have caused my mother a lawsuit in the past. They are closed minded and wholly ridiculous.

I call myself a Catholic but I worship alone and have rejected the false notion of the need for a church.

I worship Jesus Christ as a part of the Trinity with God and the Holy Spirit, not simply Jesus alone.


Protestant churches annoy me.

JWs are not Christianity. They're an extremist cult of fanatical followers who misinterpret everything good about the Bible.

Go ahead and insult me for that, Usurper. I don't care.

Every religion is a cult. Some are just bigger than others.

Oh my god. I totally fucking get it now. Holy shit. That's totally it.

God is a jackass in ANY branch of Christianity, as he should be.

JWs follow the word of Jesus Christ just as much, if not more than even the Catholic church does. So believers of Christ cannot be Christians you say? I'm going to disappoint you here, by NOT insulting you. You haven't brought anything new to the table, especially not the idea of calling them an extremist cult, which brings us to...




Exactly. I hate JW, and I left it. Sometimes, I feel that all branches of Christianity suck, but JW keeps shit real. Sorry they don't celebrate Christmas.

Yeah, the verse is something along the lines of "The blood of man is sacred. Any who take the blood of man will not receive the kingdom of God".

I interpret it as not killing another man, but I see how the loose (and popular) interpretation is refusing blood transfusions.

All right, I really am a little interested in what you have to say.


What's wrong with pagan holidays?

What's wrong with a belief in hell? And what does JW offer instead? More heaven?

What's wrong with worshipping Christ? Doesn't Christianity say that he is the son of God, and is God himself in human form?

What do you mean by making a symbol the object of prayer? Is it bad to pray to a crucifix or a picture of Jesus or something? It's not like people are worshipping the object on its own merits.

What are these contradictions/lack of contradictions?

How are JW the only true Christian institution left?

And how are Mormons upstanding? Mormons suck.


I realize you probably don't care enough to answer all of those, though.

They're pagan. To be specific, they're pagan, but disguised as Christian so that we can feel good.



Hell is a stupid belief. Eternal punishment is pointless. Instead of hell, JW offers more forgiveness, but no resurrection for those who are enemies of Jehovah.



Christ isn't God. Hell, Muslims point out the same thing.

And...you just answered your own question. How can Jesus be the son of god, AND god? Are you your own father?



Don't worship physical idols. The Christian God is an invisible God.



All-forgiving God + Hell. Do the math.



For starters, they don't consider having gay religious leaders.



When was the last time you saw a Mormon (No, not FLDS) on the news for committing a serious crime?

Many religions believe he was God, or is Jehovah's Witness-ism based solely on the beliefs of Islam and the teachings of the bible?


No, I am not my own father. I also, however, am not an omnipotent entity which existed prior to the creation of the universe and it's illogical to compare the two.


Most persons who pray before a cross or a depiction of Jesus or something of that nature would argue that they are not praying to the physical object, they are praying to God, but that object helps them to focus their attention fully on the object of their prayers.


But an all-forgiving God who will resurrect everyone following the apocalypse to live in a paradise — except those who are bad — makes perfect sense.



When was the last time you saw a Catholic person on the news for committing a serious crime and knew they were Catholic because their religious beliefs were pointed out during the news? Aside from persons who hold a position within the church, I can't think of any.

Also there are around 13 million mormons compared to 1.1 billion Catholics, it's not surprising you see more Catholic criminals.




If you want to go with the realest branch of Christianity, look at the Eastern Orthodox Church. They've been keeping it real since the great schism, yo

JW is based on real beliefs of Christianity, not YOUR version, which is as pure as a McDonald's beef patty.



You were made in his image, after all.



When you kneel before a giant structure to pray, it becomes the same thing. Just as they do with Holidays, your Christians call bad things by different names.



Nonexistence > Eternal Damnation

Ask any atheist. Also, it's pretty hard to NOT be saved.



Last month, actually, when a family was arrested in Phoenix for trying to exorcise their child.



Moot point, since the media loves to focus on uncommon occurrences. Why do you think FLDS (Warren Jeffs) got so much attention?



They would be a step up from what your family believes.

You know what my family's religious beliefs are?

This is the essence of why nobody here likes you Usurper. Even when you make a good point(not that you are here), you have to do it in a condecending and personally insulting manner.

This is why you don't like me. Don't try to speak for everyone. Yes, I am making good points. Yes, I have to be condescending, because this is 404. No, you're not bringing anything intelligent to this discussion.

Get out.

Not JW, apparently.

Why do you think you have to be condecending just because you're on 404? Plenty of people here are capable of making a decent point without doing so.

agreed, completely subjective

I gave reasons.

You gave nothing. You don't know anything, it's okay, we don't hate you.

if you are serious about this subject matter in a debate manner, you should know that arguing opinion isnt valid

this isnt intelligent discussion, this is shooting the shit

As a JW you don't even celebrate your own birthday or Christmas, which is supposed to be the birth of Christ. How can you follow the word of Christ if you don't believe he is the son of God? Do you even believe in the miracles that Jesus was supposed to have performed? Have you ever gotten any presents? Just curious. The only time you guys celebrate any event in life, is at a wedding, am I correct? I did hair and makeup for a JW bride one time and the things she was telling me about the religion are crazy. JW's are up there with the Mormons'. I'm not sure who's marbles are more loose. I've been to just about every different kind of church, except a JW Hall. I have no desire to ever step in one because I have a really hard time believing in a sect of Christianity that doesn't follow Christ. Come on, look at the root of the word "Christianity". Christianity was named for the followers of Christ.

JW is just another cult claiming to be the only true branch of Christianity. Every single sect of Christianity claims the same, exact thing. You have NO proof that what your religion claims to be true, is in fact true. It's all just speculation. Show me some hard proof that God says JW is the way to be, because Catholics, Episcopalians, Methodists, Seventh Day Adventists and Mormons all say that the true way to Heaven is through their church.

In fact, I don't believe that any ONE religion is the way to be. All of us are supposed to be God's children, including your crazy cults' followers. You say you are not part of it anymore, but you say that "JW keeps it real", so obviously you believe what the religion says, right? Pfft. And supposedly your people are the chosen ones? Hah, the Torah supposedly says the same thing, as does the Qur'an, both of which are outside of Christianity. Humans supposedly materialized through Creation or Evolution. If we are here through the original basis of Creation, then we are all created equal and are all God's children, correct? There should be no one set religion, or one set of beliefs that should be superior to another if that is true.

So I guess that brings me to this question. What exactly do JW believe about Creation or Evolution?

Being the best Christian is like being the smartest kid in the special ed class. Good for you.

LOL

Feern speaks the truth as usual!

What I've been saying for years. Everyone's religion says we're all going to hell, so I guess I'll see ya all in hell.



Haha, wow, us potheads agree on pretty much everything.

Us potheads are awesome

Dude, lets think of all of the wars that have been based on religion. It's so damn stupid to fight over something you aren't sure even fucking exists! I'd be pissed if I was the Muslims. They've been led to believe that they have 72 virgins waiting in paradise for them. Shit, I guess I'd wage a never-ending war if I was going to have 72 different broads to bang at the end of each day in paradise... that's something that Christianity doesn't promise you!

Well, you still go to heaven. Which is...paradise.

And most (all that I've heard of, at least) of the holy wars, crusades, etc, have been because of people using religion, not the other way around.

Well, you hope that Heaven is paradise. But we'll never really know until that time comes.

I meant that most of the holy wars and crusades have been because of opposing religious beliefs, so I guess it just came out wrong.

Only 72? And you're stuck there for eternity? Not really worth it (unless they stay virgins after you fuck them).

Jesus said a lot of stuff that made sense, but people have taken it all entirely too far. The whole concept of organized religion and church today is completely unnessecary. One's relationship with God should be a more personal one (in whatever manner one chooses to pursue it).

That's only a problem because you're materialistic.



Supposed to be, but isn't. They celebrate Memorial Day, however.



They DO believe he is the son of God, and even if they didn't, he was an enlightened human at worst. Even Jews, Muslims, and Buddhists believe he was wise.



Yes. I see where you're going here. You don't know much about JW, and you open up your argument by trying to make it look as if they are not Christians.



I only had presents from my ex GF, who felt sorry for me. :-P As mentioned earlier, Memorial Day is celebrated. Are you mad because JW doesn't engage in secular fun?



And by "up there", I suppose you mean "devout"? I'm sorry they aren't showing up to Sunday service with a hangover. Just look at what's become of most "Christians" in America.



So, you keep trying to make comments about the Kingdom hall of JW, but you've never gone to one of their services? Congrats on having a well-informed and open mind. Just about everything you've said thus far is based on something that you were misinformed about. If you're going to debate a religion, at least know what it is first. I'll finish you later.

I'm going to present an argument in two different ways. Consider this an educational exercise.

Version A:
Your point is based entirely on your experiences, and things you have misrepresented from the conversations of other people. Also, it seems like you resort to ad hominem attacks quite often, which is unneeded, especially in a conversation like this. Plus, in the final sentence it seemed like you all but compared this to Mortal Kombat. Am I to expect a Fatality, or perhaps an Animality when you return?

Version B:
You are a fucking nincompoop who can't use actual reasoning in any of your points, and resort to using your own opinions as facts, then attack people for not being able to prove your opinion wrong. Durr...you can't prove an opinion wrong. You can't prove it right, either. If you're going to debate, at least know that what a debate is first.


...now, you see a distinct difference between the two. Version A is fairly calm, fairly reasoned, and addresses problems in a constructive manner. Version B is a string of useless bullshit that you would hear out of someone with their eyes shut, and their fingers in their ears yelling "La la la la la, I am not listening!"

I commend your spirit for attempting to show people that faith in God can be a positive thing, but please, you're not doing anything except acting like all the pretentious dickheads you say make faith a horrible thing.

I can't claim to know much more about Jehovah's Witnesses than that they show up at my door at random, but...



Christmas is a pagan holiday created by the early Christian church to try and segue into its position as the dominant religion of its time. Many pagan religions celebrated the Winter Solstace with festivals and rituals, so the Christian church established the holiday to help ease the Pagans' transition into Christianity. Or they just killed them.

I agree with much of the rest of your post, particularly concerning your views on the notion of a 'true' religion and how one couldn't possibly exist without damning 90% of humanity. Otherwise I think the rest delves too much into materialism and not what should be important in life or spirituality, but of course that's only my opinion.

Concerning the Christmas issue, yes, the celebration of the solstice was common to pagan religions, and setting up the holiday then was going to ease them into the belief more. I see the holiday as a more devotional thing. It's to remember the birth of Christ, celebrate the gift that was given to us, and give as He did. I don't pass around presents and gifts on the 25th because it's a big birthday party, I give what I can because it's how He lived. It's how He died. Christ was a gift, and the only thing He wanted was for those that could to share it.

Materialism is another thing that perverts the church. Too often we celebrate holidays and special occasions with money and presents, when that's not what life is about. Too often you see someone gifted with money keeping it all for themselves, when it could help so many. What's the point in it all? Even if atheism was right, and this is all it, what's the point to investing your life in things? You can't take them with you where you're headed.

I think the thing to remember is that it's not about religion. It's not about things, problems, or any of that. It's about God, and living how He not only told us, but showed us. He showed us a relationship with God that was personal, intimate. He showed utter devotion to helping those that could be helped, and not letting anything get in His way. He showed love. That's what Christianity is about.

Materialistic? Well, I'm only a product of society, as like anyone else. Everyone is materialistic in one form or another. Don't act like you aren't or have never been. I could honestly give a shit less if I never received another present or gift in my life and I can't remember the last time I actually received a present. I'm very loved by my boyfriend, family and friends and as far as I'm concerned love is the best gift one can receive and as long as I have that I do not need anything else.

You're right. I don't know much about JW. I never claimed to be all knowing. I know what I know from what pamphlets I've seen and talking to a few JW's, who I guess must be very misinformed. I'm trying to make it look as if they are not Christians? You are sitting here trying to make it look as if any other sect of Christianity is not Christian. As I said, no one has 100% concrete proof that their sect of Christianity is the only true following of Christ and God. I was born and raised traditional Catholic. I don't agree with a lot of what Catholocism teaches. I certainly don't agree with what JW teaches. I forgot about the blood transfusion thing, too. I think it is absolutely recoculous that JW's would rather DIE than take blood that would save their life. It's apparent that the original scripture meant to not take blood from man, as in murder, but you get a group of fanatical followers to analyze it and look what happens.

We are all God's children and God loves us all. We are all supposed to have a place in Heaven. We are forgiven for our sins. If that is true (because that is what scripture says) then how is it, that JW's are the only ones who will be saved and have eternal life in Paradise? This is why I don't like religion, because all it does is entitle a group to think that their beliefs are superior to all others. It now seems that religions are the new opinions or something. They are like assholes, everyone has one. Whatever happened to "love thy neighbor?" I interpret that as each person should be accepting and loving to each other. I believe that is what Christ would have wanted, not for hundreds of different groups to be at each others' throats over how they believe Scripture should be interepreted and followed.



Thank you It's nice to see someone else who thinks rationally and outside of the box.




I think you nailed it. I agree with everything you said.

Eh.

I think the concept of the Church was best after Christ's death: A community of followers living together, sharing with one another, worshipping and spreading the good word. There wasn't exactly a need for the establishing of all the rules that led to the various schisms...but I don't think the Church (as it is) is a bad thing now - it just meddles far too much in activities that aren't it's business.

You've gotta be kidding me...this better be a joke topic.

Actually, my point is that JW is the best branch of Christianity because they strive to keep out pagan influence, which someone else has already acknowledged being entwined with the bible.

So lack of pagan traditions=better Christians? No

So staying true to your religious beliefs doesn't make you more religious?

So, you are then the one that decided the criteria for which a good person is? A good Christian? A healthy relationship with God? And your opinions cannot be wrong?

...your logic presents you as God. If that ain't "pagan", or at least blasphemous, I don't know what is.

My logic does NOT present me as a God.

Let me make an analogy.

If Christianity was gold, JW would be nearly 24 karat, and the Catholic Church would be 10 karat. The Catholic Church has many impurities, but because of what is mixed into it, it is stronger.

In the end, however, which piece of gold is worth more? 24 karat, or 10?

Bad analogy because you are forgetting one thing, God doesn't give a crap. Jesus said to accept him as the son of the Lord and his father as the on true God. As long as you do this and ask for forgiveness you will be fine.

And we have taken those pagan holidays and made them into days of worship of the Lord. They are no longer pagan.


Also, I think Opus Dei might give Jehovah's a run for their money.

Christianity at its birth was an apocalyptical religion. Meaning they expected hellfire and brimstone and the queue to heaven imminently. It was never originally designed to exist for more than the original followers lifetimes. As time went on people naturally felt the limits of this and stretched their faith into something more permanent. The majority of christian sects are simply disagreements in admin. It changed its form according to geography and the natures of the previous religion to suit the followers in a particular area. Some like to try and put it back to its original apocalyptical form. But at this distance from the original birth it only makes a sect different not purer. Religion is as organic as the people who create it. It is just a way for humans to comprehend something bigger than themselves. A good Christian is simply someone who follows their religion's requirements. This can't make the JW mob any better than any of the others surely?

Yes, because Usurper is/used to be a JW.

Well done Dei.